Hero or Dumbness Syndrome....

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Permalink Reply by Rob Odenwald on March 23, 2009 at 4:10pm

I have been finding similar experiences with firefighters of all ranks and experience. Keep training, training and more training in similar situations. We don't train enough and to often write off the basics. We have to do things 7-8 times before it becomes second nature, but we can't perform them every once in awhile. SCBA drills for example need to be performed a couple of times a year to stay proficient. Without knowing the experience of your Lt it would be hard to determine why he did what he did. He may have had tunnel vision or failed to understand the importance of the drill. Your right, it was poor leadership and good leaders will lead by example. An evacuation drill is a simple drill to save firefighters lives. Hopefully your cief officers talked to the Lt. about his actions.

Keep training.

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Permalink Reply by fireman1049 on March 24, 2009 at 11:23am

Rob, thank you for the input.I agree with you on basic drills....i for one will keep practicing SCBA. Mainly to prevent becoming compliant...i will pass it on to the asst chief who was there as well also... the Lt who panicked has 10 years in the fire service roughly..

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Permalink Reply by Asst. 29 on April 3, 2009 at 3:12pm

I'm not trying to be rude but does your company train like it's the real deal? Or do you just go through the motions? Was it stated that this should have been treated as if it is the real deal? In your LT's defense he could have been just going through the steps of search and rescue and figured someone was just messing around. May be he is not proficient at multitasking. Repetition is definitely key. I would keep doing the drill till he gets it right. It is called a drill and sometimes it must be drilled into some people, even those you wouldn't expect.

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Permalink Reply by Padre Pete on May 5, 2009 at 10:49pm

GREAT TRAINING OPPORTUNITY. Interior crew not responding? That requires an emergency priority response. Was the FAS Team sent in to rescue and retrieve? If not, why not? A logicl progression of realistic events here would have cleared up any misunderstanding in regard to appropriate response to the alarm. Especialy when they found their butts being dragged out. If he's not on his way out after that alarm sounds, anything he's doing becomes FREELANCING and that is the dirtiest of all "F" words. Evacuate then discuss any disagreement, but evacuate first. This may not be your Lt. but those who will put thier own agenda ahead of the teams are much more likely to cause harm. "Train often. Be safe."-T. Schmittendorf "You will never go in or come out alone."- me

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Permalink Reply by John LeBlanc on June 30, 2009 at 7:49pm

I agree with Padre Pete, it is a great training opportunity. Not knowing the FD training schedule if there is any, or how often they train in SCBA, primary search, secondary search, calling MAYDAY and communication abilities other than radio communication for evac. (i.e. air horn on an apparatus). Got to revisit the basics. In my fire house we got everyone involve in dreaming and setting up training. One thing I notice in the past year when my group is responsable to set up the training we are the only one going back to basics. While others choose to do more on the technical training. Both are essential to our skills... One thing I can pass around for info, his have a briefing of what the training goal is, and before going for the pratical part of it, I always state "look out for the unexpected". We all know that thing can change on us so fast. That is where I add the Emergency evac or any other scenario, it is never the same and keeps everyone on their toes.

Training is key to our safety, so stay safe out there.

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Permalink Reply by Chief Ron King on June 30, 2009 at 10:00pm

I made all kind of mistakes when I was a Lt. Our chief at that time helped me so much. I still look up to him he always has the right answers. We grow by training. We our a team it takes everyone working together to be good. Watch out for each other. we all do bad things at times. sometimes we just are not thinking. Help each other our life is in each others hands. Working together we will get the job done.

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Permalink Reply by Richard Sullivan on July 17, 2009 at 9:05am

As a Training Officer for my large paid department, I have got in the habit of setting out the "parameters" of a training drill to eveyone involved before the training begins. By making sure that all participants know "what you see or hear is all to be treated as real" really helps eveyone to get on the same page mentally before the evolution begins and avoids confusion when someone decides to activate a trucks airhorn to initiate an evacuation as described in this case.

I'm not sure if this is the reason the Lt. didn't evacuate the training room but again, from my perspective as a Training Officer these types of "parameters" need to be identified and communicated to everyone to make the most out of training..Try it!

Just my thoughts.

Richard Sullivan
Halifax Fire (Canada)

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Permalink Reply by Chief Mike France on September 10, 2009 at 11:09am

SCBA drills are needed every month along with MAsk Confidence drills, its seems they keep forgetting what to do, You make the officer do what you expect the Ff to do, it is lead by example, i as a chief have to these drills even thou i don't go in anymore. if the officer is made to show the FF he/she needs to lead by EXAMPLE. it doe's make things dull but The Basics need to done all the time , we are Human we tend to forget . Talk to the Lt. on the sideline , Don't yell talk to them, show them it works.

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